Bitcoin Investment Strategy/Digital Assets with Gary Cardone.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Hello everybody. Welcome to another episode of Arthur's Roundtable. Super grateful to have Gary Cardone here and a shout out to our dear friend, Meghna, for making the introduction. Gary and I don't know each other. We're just getting acquainted now, but it's all Meghna's fault, so take that. Thank you, Gary, for doing this. Let's start with sort of the beginning of your journey, if you're willing to share, and we'll just take it from there. Is that all right? Yeah.

Gary Cardone

: Richard grew up in Lake Charles, Louisiana, the west side of Louisiana, near Texas border, so opposite of New Orleans. Five children, all separated by five years, except for me and my famous twin brother, Five Minutes. Italian, Sicilian family, my dad was a stockbroker, he dies at eight years old. And that moment I realized, oh wow, this world doesn't really do any guarantees, it?

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: No, it doesn't.

Gary Cardone

: You know, mean, that was a very interesting lesson that probably has helped me a lot. Well, it just really smacked me in the face. And no matter what anyone says, hey, time will heal all things. Well, they just had not ever been through that experience. It most certainly didn't heal it. The time hasn't healed that event. But I think it made me pretty tough in a way that you're not going to get no guarantees or full guarantee. Like, know, so, so anyway,

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: It's formative, right? Yeah.

Gary Cardone

: I went to college, did economics, marketing, lived with a mom that was terrified. She was 42 when she had us. So she's 52 years old, two 10-year-old boys that were just putting for a piss and vinegar. Another 15-year-old brother that was trouble. You know, just had a lot of energy, right? And no male mentoring. And like, I really take my hat off to my mom. As a parent today, I'm like, wow, man, I don't know what.

Gary Cardone

: how she put up with us because we were really rude. The greatest gift she gave me was at 20 years old, she said, I'll get the F out of my house and don't ever come back. I will not do the dirty work. I'm not cooking you any meals. You guys have no respect for me. So get the F out and stay away. That was that moment. And I speak to every parent. That moment is the greatest thing that woman ever gave me because it really

Gary Cardone

: She made me man up. I wouldn't have been up in prison if she would have kept her breasts in my face. She really needed to kick us out. And if you have a kid that's being disrespectful, him the fuck out of the house and tell him to go grow up or die. I mean, figure it out.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Alright.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Definition of tough love, right?

Gary Cardone

: It's totally Arthur. It's a really great lesson that I need to remember. So I went off to Winston, got a job, got into oil and gas business. That was really, really, you know, I felt really fortunate for that. It was the middle of the largest output of now what would be called boomers into the marketplace for jobs in the biggest recession we've ever seen. Now again,

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Mm-hmm.

Gary Cardone

: Here's another one. Oh, I could sit there. I hear these kids today going, Oh, what am I going to do? There's no jobs. can't afford a $800 million house. And I'm like, play the card you've been dealt, Like, it's not my fault that you came into this crazy insane planet in 2026 and you're ready to go into the workforce. I didn't do this to you. Okay. Like this is just the way the cards fell.

Gary Cardone

: And there must be some great lesson in there for you because I think I could do exceptionally well in the world we're going into with the mindset I've had. I just think you're going to have to be very, very adaptable and expect no guarantees from anyone and bring more value than you take.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Isn't it true? It's not your circumstances. It's what you do with them,

Gary Cardone

: Yeah, I I've won very big card wins with a six and a four off suit. know, you just like, blaming the situation is not gonna solve anything. I'm actually worried about my children because, you know, they have a bigger safety net than I had. I mean, certainly it's not gonna be like I'm gonna pull the rug out from under them, but.

Gary Cardone

: I did, you know, my lifestyle wasn't anything near theirs and I just sometimes wonder, you know, can they, can you man up without having these really horrible events? Because I look at people that are really, successful, they make a big difference in the world. Every one of them had some kind of damage in their background. Every one of them, right?

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Yeah, trauma, experience. Yeah, it was instructive. I've seen that also. I think it's pretty, pretty resolved that people who've had some hard times come out of it stronger.

Gary Cardone

: Yeah, yeah, most certainly. So I'm working for an oil and gas company in Houston, big name, big company, making 70 grand a year. I'm 26 years old and I was so miserable. I could not imagine working in a big building with three levels of people on top of me that understood less than I did about what we were doing. And I wasn't being arrogant. was just like, wow, I don't think that's what the time when

Gary Cardone

: The entire energy market was undergoing this massive transformation that the government tried to initiate through lobbies from guys like me that were looking for a free market. And I watched everyone in oil and gas business that had any experience really hold on to the past. They did not like the change of a regulatory change that would create competition.

Gary Cardone

: I'm going with the biggest oil companies in the world, big pipeline companies. I'm 25 years old. because I had no baggage or what's a membership things to a cartel, a club, a group of people, that group of people happened to be the long gas business. They look like they were competing with each other, but in reality, they weren't competing with each other. They were going to country clubs, playing golf, having dinners.

Gary Cardone

: One guy would go from Conoco to Phillips, Phillips to Noble. And you know, everyone's going to be like, hey, I need to be nice. It's a little bit like the legal world, you know? You go into these lawyers and you're like, they're all buddies. They're all buddies defending me for 40 million dollars, right?

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: I'll offer them to another, yeah. Yeah.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: and they go in, do battle in the courtroom and then share notes outside, right?

Gary Cardone

: Exactly. And share more than notes. So, they weren't, they were used to doing big long contracts, took a lot of time. There was no one ever judged. People made decisions by committees. And we were talking about pricing energy one day, one hour at a time, making it super efficient, right? And the last thing they wanted to do was have transparency. I mean, I agree with, for instance,

Gary Cardone

: I went to my boss, we have a 36 inch pipeline from Mexico to Houston, Texas, from El Paso to Houston, Texas. It's completely empty, 36 inch pipeline, massive pipeline, holds a building plus cubic feet a day. My job is to fill the pipe up. I'm 23 years old, okay, I this was an awesome experience. Contracts this big, worlds I didn't even understand. I the word force majeure, I'm like, oh my God, what does that mean?

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Yeah, right.

Gary Cardone

: But that education, just getting out of school and going into a platform that's really speak to the families and the kids. Like look for a platform where you can be exceptional. It might not be the best team, it might not be the Harvard team, it might be the next level or other level team where the ocean's not so big that you can't make a difference. I think some people go into the IBM's, Martin Stanley's thing and this is the deal, right? Like dude, you're getting lost.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Yeah, you get lost. Yeah.

Gary Cardone

: You get lost. so I'm doing this and I look at the guy said, well, the contract offers him six, $7.36. And I'm like, the next pipeline is 800 miles away, man. Like that would cost him $2. Why don't we offer the guy seven bucks even? And he said, nah, we don't mess around with nickels and pennies. Nickels and dimes, I think. That was a billion cubic feet a day. Do the math on penny.

Gary Cardone

: Now it trades at, you know, one tenth of a penny. But my point is they just weren't comfortable or used to, they had never really negotiated with each other on half a cent. For them it would be disrespectful, right? What I'm headed with this is that in the massive turbulent time, high recessionary pressure, massive regulatory change, a new kid 25 years old walks in the oil and gas industry,

Gary Cardone

: And we'd walk out by the age of 41 having won through multi-billion dollar energy companies. And it was just simple because I was willing to go with the flow. I had no baggage to carry. I was like, hey, somebody wants to trade for a penny. There's a spread there. I can do value. Let's split it even, And that education would really set me up to never

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Yeah.

Gary Cardone

: I ended up leaving the big corporation and went to work for a startup. A company called Natural Grass Clearinghouse, was 12 other people there and I would never go back and work for another corporation ever again. I would build them. And then I would learn, hey, when a company gets to be 150 people, you need to get out. You need to get out and go build another one that's small because I'm really good with the smaller groups. I don't want to manage 150 people. I don't want hear about HR. It's not where my skills are.

Gary Cardone

: And I have a very negative view on HR.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Yeah, what a nightmare. Was that during the Enron years?

Gary Cardone

: I was born to a lady of Inwong. She and I, I don't know if we were married at the time, but we were most certainly sleeping in the same bed. We controlled 90%, maybe 95 % of all the molecules that were sold in California, man. Sleeping in the same freaking bed. Two phone calls from San Diego, guessing like it was crazy times. That industry today,

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Wow.

Gary Cardone

: I just remind people the industry we're getting ready to move into this, what I call digitization of planet Earth. 25 and 28 and 29 year old men reformed and reshaped the entire energy construct, electricity and natural gas, and they did it in eight years. It's really, the whole Enron era, Enron was really right on so many things about the commoditization of the market where

Gary Cardone

: Transparency is introduced like ultra transparency today and those markets should settle at fractions of pennies. become hyper efficient. Too bad they ran out of ran out of time and they oversold what they were doing. But certainly the construct was right and it shows that outsiders always make these massive step changes. The insiders never do it.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Because the legacy thinking,

Gary Cardone

: Correct. That means Google will not win the game in AI. It's going to be the outsiders. I don't think Meta survives this because they don't bring any true value to the planet. I hope that's where we're headed. Where value is understood. It's not so easily quantified. We quantify everything, but we don't qualify very much.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: value gets rewarded. Yeah.

Gary Cardone

: I think value is grossly misrepresented in the market. Everything is priced, but I don't think value is priced properly.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: So what do you think of, just as an aside, because it was super entertaining, Landman, as a representation of what it's really like down there?

Gary Cardone

: extremely accurate. The first songs I watched, I watched them with a friend of mine, I'm like, oh wow, I can't even match it with you because I know all these people. I mean, all the people that are listening, I'm like, oh wow, I know where their offices are. I mean, I got drunk with these people, right? I mean, a very accurate story. I think the mindset's accurate. And it's a very good thing for the world, especially people that are young or and they're

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Yeah, right.

Gary Cardone

: convince that Rune and Sola can solve the problems.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Yeah, that little segment where he made the speech with the lawyer. Yeah. Yeah. Basically called everybody out and said, you can, you can say you want to do all this. And it's, I get miffed regularly because there's a lot of people in the world that really are well intentioned, but if you don't measure something, it doesn't get better. And so they come out and they do this virtual signaling and said, like, I want the world not to burn because of climate change.

Gary Cardone

: Everything we lose touches out there.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: And then they, then it falls flat from there because they don't do anything or they just say that because they want to be perceived as a good person. And I'm using climate change, change as a, as just an example, there's dozens and dozens of people that come out and say, here's something that sounds good, but then that's it. It falls flat, right?

Gary Cardone

: Yeah, well like, you know, I mean, if people just looked at how much concrete it takes, the main point is to fund it, to fill it, to use capital, then to maintain it, how many birds it kills, how long it lasts. You'd be really disabused that wind is anything other than a joke, a complete joke. And it's going to make Europe

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: is a joke.

Gary Cardone

: become a third world continent, their energy policy is going to imprison the entire continent of Europe. And only the edges are going to survive this. It's going to be the Eastern European and the Southern European countries that survive this, and everyone else is going to get between Norway and the South. They're going to get – they're turning into a prison plant. That's what I think the continent of Europe is. They have no energy, they have no logistics or capacity

Gary Cardone

: to produce and move energy. is no agriculture. There is no manufacturing whatsoever. And now there is no fucking tourism. Because it's dangerous to be there.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: It's dangerous to be there. what they said in that segment was that you can say, tell me if you think this is still accurate. You can say whatever you want about oil ruining the planet, but everything we do needs it. And we are struggling to get enough of it to satisfy the appetite of the population. So say what you want. If we stop making it, the whole thing melts down.

Gary Cardone

: Well, we won't stop making it. We will never run out of in this type of energy. Fossil fuel energy we're not going to run out of. The price of it would be a different question. I think actually the price will come down forever. And that in my lifetime, assuming I live to be 90 or so, we'll see crude oil at $10 or $15, $20. And we'll see the energy companies making money more margin than they were making.

Gary Cardone

: Wind and solar, solar may be a thing, look, we're forgetting what happens if there is a technology. I mean, I understand Sweden or Denmark are experimenting with electricity that has no wires right now. And you've only seen some these battery storage devices you can not even plug your phone into. We're delivering one technology. Well, let's talk about the Iran.

Gary Cardone

: thing. These ones will have 6 to 11 to 20 million barrels. I have a very, very different view on this than most people. I think 35 % of all the energy we use is a bucket of energy. In certain locations, we will have constraints and problems. But I think 45%, maybe 45 % of all the energy we use is convenience energy. You and I

Gary Cardone

: Probably the very comfortable homes. I take at least one hot bath a day. Don't care how much hot water I use. I don't know anyone that turns off their PC at night. That tells me electricity is too cheap. I want to what I'm doing for all the spoiled Americans that don't know that 40 % of the entire population of planet Earth still cooks on wood. I ain't cooked on wood.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Yeah, not amazing.

Gary Cardone

: a long long time unless it was for a picnic to impress my kids how stupid I was at building a fire. Right? um, I don't need my home at 72. I could have it at 82. I don't have to go on that trip. I'm most certainly not buying an airline ticket. It was 400 knots at 8, uh, 4,000. And that's a real number. I mean, all airlines have moved in 10 days somewhere between 3X and 7X.

Gary Cardone

: A private jet from Tampa to Vegas and back was $84,000 a year ago, now it's $127,000. So we really need to understand what the impacts of oil are. And everyone in audience is going be, oh, those bad oil companies. Those bad oil companies didn't do this. They didn't want this to happen. They were looking, no, the government did this, man. Two countries did this.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Yeah.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: The consumer did it, right?

Gary Cardone

: I was in the blue and white side. Well, I mean, we blew up a pipeline that was going to roll up four years ago called Nord Stream. Someone blew that up. It did not happen by two guys smoking a cigarette in a rowboat. I suspect we did it. We strangle, choked Germany, Italy, France.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: explain that.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: right.

Gary Cardone

: Now, Germany is so freaked out. are the most expensive. UK and Germany have the most expensive electricity in the free world. Five times more expensive than a manufacturer in the United States. No one is going to manufacture anything in the UK. Not a cup of tea, not a cup of anything. By the way, they stopped producing anything many years ago. Many. I can't even remember that.

Gary Cardone

: The mercy of all fields are drained. They have regulatory process that is almost like fascist. I mean, it's impossible. No one would go bore the business over their tax policies. Right?

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Yeah, same thing with France, right? You can't own a business in France. Yeah.

Gary Cardone

: Well, France is interesting because they're all nuclear. Okay, they build all our nukes. So I think when Europe ends up, because they have now seen that they don't have access and they don't have a pipeline that has access to the cheapest energy in the world, Russia, they're going to become a net importer of everything and have very little control. I don't even know how they survive. I don't think the continent of Europe survives this.

Gary Cardone

: I mean, the Haliburton's and the Raytheons are going to make a humongous amount of money at a really boring continental warp into 15 minute terraces. Like I think it's going to be, hey, let's run the experiment right here. From the moment you cross our continent of Europe, ID, CBGC, digital information can only drive this far. You can only go this many times out of the country.

Gary Cardone

: That would be the way to handle the irrigation issue that they let go for 20 plus million people for the last 20 years with no assimilation whatsoever. Let's just lock them all up.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Yeah. It's all of those those. And the prohibitions are happening live right now. It's insane, right?

Gary Cardone

: It be efficient if this particular child

Gary Cardone

: Yeah. mean, six months ago I said, Hey, won't travel to London because I'm scared. love London. I'm scared they won't let me in or out because you know, you don't know. Like everyone's being monitored right now what they're doing. It just seems like all the politicians have gone completely off the edge of reality and it's going to bite us. It's biting us right now.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Yeah.

Gary Cardone

: We've seen gasoline in Florida go from $3 to $4.50 in less than four weeks. It doesn't impact me at all, okay? But it impacts everybody else, It's a huge problem, right? It's $10 in Italy. If you can get it, I have a friend near the UK, he's out of diesel. Can't get diesel. We're just starting here. This is just starting, Here is a massive problem.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: It does impact a lot of people.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Is that? Is

Gary Cardone

: Okay, there isn't any AI chips made without helium. Okay, 40 % of the helium's supply goes through the straight-o-hormones. Fertilizers, nitrogen, I mean, it's going to impact food supplies. We've been impacting the entire supply chain since before Ukraine.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Right. Yeah.

Gary Cardone

: Someone keeps interfering. See, I think COVID was a supply shock intervention that created inflation and then massive deflation, right? And what we're doing right now is what I think we're doing COVID 2.0.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: It's been sick? Yeah.

Gary Cardone

: And like this is not, this is not cool what we're doing. This is really impactful for the world economy for a long, long time.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: So what do you think, since we're talking about it, there are forces in the world that allegedly want chaos simply because it lets them do what they otherwise would like to do. And I'm not sure that makes sense, but there's chaos all over the place, and it seems to be

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: You know, the people who are protesting on the streets aren't there because they feel strongly about free Palestine or this or that or the war. It's because someone's paying them because it's pretty clear that most of them don't know anything about why they're there.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: So why do you think someone would want to sow chaos? What's the end game there?

Gary Cardone

: I was reading the report just today and it was talking about three companies have 82 % of all the energy supplies in the United States and three companies control 62 % of the steel market and three companies control their banking. And in our dad, hey, two companies that make a 51 % a 46 % gross operating profit control 72 % of the credit card market.

Gary Cardone

: 51 % for the family offices come on, 51 and 46 % gross operating margins for two companies that we're not going to say these are high tech companies, okay, these are master card. And no one's going to disagree with me, they are really, charging more than the hard nose, 3.5%.

Gary Cardone

: on every transaction. They were monitoring every transaction. They know that RFID chip is more than a transaction chip. It is a monitoring chip. And we continue to allow it to occur. I heard the other day that the Europeans were more concerned about Visa and MasterCard pulling all their cards. Like this is the European, because we've done it twice to the Russians. Okay.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Yeah. Data collection.

Gary Cardone

: These are not public companies that you and I know, man. These are servants of a government pretending to be public companies. We're not the America that you and I grew up to be, which is a free marketplace. There is not one industry here, including, by the way, our great friends and I'm sure massively trustworthy industry titans, Mark Zuckerberg and the Google boys. They own 72 % of all the social media.

Gary Cardone

: Okay, we have the medical industry, insurance all wrapped up in like maybe three companies. You aren't healthcare is touching everything on the planet. It's a lie that we have free markets. We are a fascist cartel country, I can't believe Donald Trump wakes up every morning and feels proud of what we're doing here. It's so obvious to me. This is a scam. I grew up thinking that I could compete on my merit.

Gary Cardone

: I could compete on my merit and innovate and bring solutions and nobody would stop me. And that's just not the way the market works today. And the consumer is being completely rogered because of no choice, little choice, lack of ability to migrate, a lack of understanding of any agreement, they have been forced to sign online. Electronic signatures.

Gary Cardone

: GPD, all these security things, KYC, AML, the policies they wrote in Europe, GPO, DER, whatever, all these activities. These have been basically intelligence gathering activities in a way that brought competition. If financial came here and tried to provide credit card services, they lasted a year. These are the masks.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: 80 PR, yeah.

Gary Cardone

: These amnesty cards provide insurance to consumers that allow consumers to commit fraud against the retailer and they make billions and billions and billions of dollars from it. It's staggering. The market has become so bastardized from what we grew up learning and believing.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: doing it. So

Gary Cardone

: Quite frankly, the government should just move into all services. mean, maybe that's where the head is. The sovereigns just own everything like every other country. But let's get rid of all the middlemen. Okay, because we don't need to pay Visa and MasterCard. Let me just pay Bank of America. In fact, let me just go straight to the Federal Reserve. We get rid of Bank of America, Wells Fargo, Visa and MasterCard, and about 100,000 payment processors who are normally clipping.

Gary Cardone

: 300 to 500 basis points on retail products that you are not paying for really brings no value to anything.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: So one would argue that, you know, so let me ask it this way. When you and I grew up, we felt like the American dream, things were pretty well managed. If you worked hard, could, like, was a meritocracy. Like, you could go for it, grab the world by the throat.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: work hard like you did at the oil company like I did in my businesses, and you were rewarded for being innovative, working hard, being smart, that sort of thing. When do you think the wheel started coming off to make it? So by the way, I agree with you, there's little escaping the big brother, right? Everything is data, right?

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Even though they're clipping.

Gary Cardone

: Well, we were headwinking that. Okay, we were headwinking that. And that we were headwinked into all this data, okay? Our government did not protect us. Our DOJ certainly did not protect us. The FTC, the Federal Trade Commission, was supposed to protect consumers. They must have spent

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Say it again. Yes. Yeah.

Gary Cardone

: four years and millions of dollars trying to prosecute me for something that after two and a half years, I built a credit card payment technology to stop all these chargebacks on Visa and MasterCard. I'm like, wow, what a scam. I mean, built a business making 70, $100 million a year around protecting the merchant from Visa, MasterCard, and their consumer abuse. Buy a $200 pair of shoes and go, hey, I didn't get them.

Gary Cardone

: And it's so expensive for it's, oh it's total fraud, cyber fraud. They call it friendly fraud. They hired a lobby team to come up with a name. Friendly fraud. like they were friendly fraud, enemy fraud, it costed me totally the same. And guess who's paying for it? Me. The good consumer's paying for this unnecessary bullshit. Right? I mean in China, I can't come in here and be a bank and provide credit card processing. Because

Gary Cardone

: They don't have the ability to provide insurance, chargeback insurance. It just says, the card scams in cartels are unhealthy. And I started it with my story in 1981 in the energy business. I said, hey, why don't we give the guy $7, not $7.36. He says, ah, we don't trade on nickels and dimes. Well, that's not efficient. OK, that was not my job. My job was to fill the pipe up with cheap fuel.

Gary Cardone

: not to overpay, not to underpay. And how do I know if I'm overpaying or underpaying if there's no competition? But then you get to competition into marginal pricing. And that's what crude oil is the symbol of the greatest commercial marketing ever created. It was very difficult to control crude oil prices. We've learned that over 40 years, man. OPEC, OPEC One, OPEC Super, OPEC Two.

Gary Cardone

: Every one these clubs break up because ballers have a way of moving around. You can't stop them.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: So let's go back to your example. The chargeback business that you built, why did they want to crush that? Forget about the legal issues. Why did Visa and MasterCard want to crush that? You would think that Visa and MasterCard would want to figure out how to keep that friendly fraud from happening.

Gary Cardone

: Well, not when you're not allowed to go buy two companies and then provide the only insurance policy against that very fraud. This is my problem with these court schemes. Like they're allowed to buy companies, then close the whole market off. They sell me a $27 product and they say, you cannot price this under $50. So they're managing price. That's interest.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: So they were underwriting insurance costs.

Gary Cardone

: Fuck, I can't trust that they would really say, cannot sell below $50 to a particular customer and they're not selling the same product for $48. Okay, it's not, that is not allowing competition. And by the way, I spent $22 million a year with them. mean, they're going around the world, people are spending money with them. So, one thing we want to know is all of these companies, whether they're oil,

Gary Cardone

: Cricket court players.

Gary Cardone

: The global plan is too big for all these companies. They're so narcissistic and they're so insane to think that they can be everything to everyone, including Facebook's, you know. Facebook just did an 80-billion-dollar write-off. 80-billion, six years old, changed their company name from Facebook to Metta because Mark Zuckerberg was going to be a synthetic, infinite being in his Metta universe.

Gary Cardone

: He just said, we're done with Metta. Fuck Metta, that was a dumb experiment. $80 billion, man. How did somebody get away with that, okay? Come on. Okay, this is the same guy that, by the way, went on TV and said that multiple divisions inside the United States were requiring him to give up his data. He didn't tell the TRI there's other data. He didn't tell the board. And like I think he's already committed so many crimes, it's unbelievable. He's a public company.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Yeah. What's that tell you?

Gary Cardone

: His job is to protect his soil, but not to talk to the government.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Yeah. It's pretty clear that he had a gun to his head. And I mean, let's just blame the prior administration for doing what they did, right? It doesn't need to be political, but that administration is the one that held the gun to his head. And he either acquiesced to that or he didn't, and he did, right? So I give him credit for coming out and saying it publicly, but he had nothing to lose at this point.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: coming out and saying it, right? It's all history. It's just that most people didn't believe that the government would actually do that, right? But they did.

Gary Cardone

: Well, since we just got a $200, $254 million settlement because he abused children's data, this is after that, you know, he became a good human being and went public with what's, what clearly was getting ready to be discovered anyway. I give the guy zero credit for doing anything. Like he was creating one of the most heinous products.

Gary Cardone

: in the history of mankind. has not helped America.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Facebook has caused so many people, not just children, adults.

Gary Cardone

: This is what I don't understand. I see a company like ExxonMobil. They go to work every day. They lose lives over fun. It's energy, man. It's stuff we use. And people bitch about the oil companies. And then they watch Facebook. And I'm like, wow, you should be complaining about the plugs they're putting in your kids' brains, man.

Gary Cardone

: At least when get diesel put into my tractor, I know what it is. I know really what's in the diesel. So we've gotten really far off base, but I'm trying to go to where I think that we've gotten really a long way away from transparency. And every time you move away from transparency, you end up in this opaque world, the black box,

Gary Cardone

: And that is where all the crime, mistakes, and errors are hidden. So in the audience, where there is opacity, there is a lie. There is a mistake, there is something that's being hidden, and it is never good for you. It is never good for the masses, ever, ever, ever. And it should be our motto going for the next 40 years. Transparency is the key. You can be my president. Let's be transparent. You want to raise taxes? Cool.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: and fraud.

Gary Cardone

: What are you spending them on? I'm happy to give tax money. I'm not happy to kill anymore people though. Like my money now, I'm not kidding. wow, my money is being used to build weapons to kill innocent people. And if we all stood up and got really open voice and transparency, like you said, let's not get political. We're going to have to get political at this point. We can't go, listen.

Gary Cardone

: 51 in a 36 % gross operating margin, 50 world companies. That's not even being allowed. This is what we want. We want two or three players we can make a phone call to. That is a very scary world to me. Because they don't like guys like you and I, They're not going to let a guy like me bring value. Because I bring a lot of value. I bring truth.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: No.

Gary Cardone

: And the month like I don't take that.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: They would throw us under the bus in a minute. So let's talk about what, aside from being political, which is totally cool, what, you know,

Gary Cardone

: Exactly.

Gary Cardone

: Exactly.

Gary Cardone

: Well, I'll hold it. I'll hold it. But I just don't think... I don't think you can leave that part of deal out because it's cool. I mean, it is part of the commercial landscape now. You can't... I'm not invited to the table on some of these. That's not cool. Okay. Oh, you've just invited the big boys. The club. know, McKenzie, Cap Jim. You know, they'll all be there. Pricewaterhouse.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Yeah.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Totally.

Gary Cardone

: Until they start realizing, well, this is getting ready to get real. AY is getting ready to expose a lot of people. This is what we're all trying to get to with the transparency. And that's why I love AI, because I don't think we can do any worse. The evolution where we are as a country or a race, I don't think you can do any worse, OK? And AY would be a better governor, a better teacher.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Now what?

Gary Cardone

: A barrier to parents than most parents? yeah, a barrier than most parents. They would most certainly be consistent. They're not going to be on drugs. They're going to be able to teach your kids soccer teams, not soccer. They'll also be able to teach your kids soccer. Perfect soccer, by the way. You don't have to hire a coach. And then they can learn how to do Chopin at night. Anyone want my dog? I'd pay somebody $400 a month to want my dog.

Gary Cardone

: Now I have my dogs walk perfectly. Now have dogs that are consistent, well trained on every... I mean, there's a lot... I am hoping that's where this takes us.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: I think there's going to be a lot of good that comes from it. We'll talk more about it offline, but we're knee deep in all this stuff too. But if it's okay with you, I want to touch on, you know, part of what I can do and perhaps others and what you can do to thwart some of these problems besides being active to fight it is I'm just going off the grid.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: I'm taking my stuff and right. Because even though there's lots of fraud and bad actors in that business, my digital assets are out of the hands of anybody who's overseeing me. And so that might be my. Yeah. Yeah, we could do that.

Gary Cardone

: Are we going to talk about crypto? Are we going to talk about digital asset oil?

Gary Cardone

: So you're not talking about lower off the grid, you're talking about having the option to be off the grid.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: I'm actually talking about both, right? But for the time being, I still have to live in this world and I'm going to be off the grid to some extent, but not forever because I have kids and grandkids and I want to be involved in all that. But I'm talking about this where, you know, I don't need everybody knowing my business, right? Not because I'm a bad actor, not because because there'll be plenty of bad actors and there have been in the crypto and

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: blockchain world. But, you know, if the shit hits the fan, and there's things that I just don't want people to know, period.

Gary Cardone

: I think that the blockchain and digital assets like Bitcoin give you more anonymity than anything else.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: I don't think that the Bitcoin gives you anonymity because it's pretty public what that's all about, right?

Gary Cardone

: Yeah, I'm trying to hang with you on the, I don't want people to know what I'm doing or what I have and how that plays into the crypto piece. I think that's, I just don't know if that's real, right? Like it seems to me, like everybody knows, pull the course to what everybody has in crypto.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Yes, it has been, I think what I'm getting at is I'm off the Visa MasterCard rails, right?

Gary Cardone

: Yeah, you're using other technologies and apps other than the typical roles. Yeah. This is why, you know, I started in energy, so natural gas go from, and I think natural gas and water like electricity, they define if you're full second or full billion nation. So they're more important than T-shirts. Right? Meaning that if they go a role, it's really significant. If you take

Gary Cardone

: If you take the credit card industry away, I don't think that anything's going to be a problem. I just look at, wow, we move natural gas from $7. People have been telling me oil is going to go to $300 forever and ever. It's never done that. We need to do this transparency, and what we find is that there's 10x the volume that's shown up. Producers are drilling to the futures market because they know the market's there.

Gary Cardone

: We have very little efficiency though, because we have little transparency. I look at the Bitcoin story, I'm like, wow, this is awesome. This is awesome. Finally, what have we been talking about today? DOJ, FBI, FTC, all these guys that are supposed to manage the world, they're supposed to live in a free world with free voice and free choice and open access and open markets. But the truth is we don't.

Gary Cardone

: because the transparency over the last 20 years has just done this. wah, just gotten smaller and smaller and smaller. I've seen Bitcoin like, no central authority to be able to buy off of shares or to able to buy off with, hey, I realize that you're, you you like having gay sex on Saturday nights at 2 AM. How you like these pictures? the way, I need this favor from you. That's really cool. Okay.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Yeah. Yeah.

Gary Cardone

: To be able to go to a church, I grew up being Catholic and then 22 years old, realized, whoa, there's a lot of pedophilia going on in my club. And I saw the management team and the management team was like, I'm like, I'm out. If you're not calling the birds out in your management team, then you're as criminal as the people that did whatever. So I got out of that group. Every group I get into, I'm like, oh wow, another human group.

Gary Cardone

: Bitcoin offers me the least amount of human error risk and human error includes evil people, Or a mistake, just a general mistake. I am the only person in the Bitcoin world that has any element of risk associated with my holdings. And I get to choose how much risk I want to take or not take. At zero cost, it costs 30 cents a month.

Gary Cardone

: Just hang with me. $0.40 a month to store a unit of natural gas. It costs $5 a month to store a barrel of oil. And there's a shitload of it being stored right now on ships. And it costs money to store gold bullion every month. I don't know exact price. I can store a billion dollars worth of Bitcoin in my wallet in my front.

Gary Cardone

: pocket next to my Glock and put zero storage fees for all there. See I look at Bitcoin really different. I'm like my god no storage fees. Awesome. I don't have to talk to everybody. Cool. I can work that money on a Saturday afternoon and buy a company. I bought node 40 on a Saturday afternoon with Bitcoin. No one in world could have transacted. They needed to sell when I was a buyer.

Gary Cardone

: And I was able to buy a company because I had liquidity on a Saturday afternoon, man. It's awesome. This is how I my brother into this. I'm like, bro, I want to start a Vulture Fund and just have Bitcoin sitting in the fund. And we just wait. Hey, banks, and just start knocking on your back. Hey, if you guys want to do a $400 million deal, let us know right before your covenants breach on Monday morning at 9 a.m.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Isn't that crazy?

Gary Cardone

: You can call on Sunday, okay? I can transact. You may not like to remember, but you like to remember more? Then your competitors start watching this shit at 9 a.m. Because everybody starts saying, he gets a great idea. The stress, and you go to all the Bitcoin, they all say, you gotta do it. If we can't get a 24 % return, we ain't doing it. We're sitting here, just, we're moving, just buy it, you're buying, right?

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: I love that idea. Distressed asset on a Saturday afternoon. You're right.

Gary Cardone

: But when you get that that quick, I'm like, people do not understand the equity value. I think they do the work to understand. There are very few products in the world that you can sell on a Sunday night. In volume. I mean, my brother, when he first came to this thing, he was like, hey, now I'm gonna move in and buy a thousand Bitcoin. I said, oh, wow, cool, that's awesome. You should buy 10,000, but okay. I'll let you step in like a little boy that you are.

Gary Cardone

: And I'm tensing them all on and he says, yeah, man, but I'm gonna move the market. And I've been trading my whole life, right? I have moved markets before. And I just looked at my brother and went, dude, you don't have to study this market, Abby. He said, well, how long you think it's gonna take me to buy a thousand Bitcoin before I move the market? I'm like, about a minute, $50 billion a day, trading Bitcoin.

Gary Cardone

: 10,000 bitcoins, but a hundred million dollars? They don't even feel it coming.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: But what caused him to think he was going to move the market just because it was a slug of money?

Gary Cardone

: Well, it's a slogan money and Bitcoin sounds like a really tiny market to me. If you ask all your legacy people, nearly your family offices will know, it trades how much? It's one of the biggest markets in the world and no one knows about it as far as liquidity goes. know, you start looking at that and the audience may not understand this, but the banks are only opened about three and half days a week.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Yeah.

Gary Cardone

: Compared to Bitcoin, probably open less than three days a week. This is open seven days a week, every minute of the day. This is going to be very challenging for the banks.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Yeah. And by the way, Gary, we know this, but when the banks say you only can bank during banking hours and you can't wire money this and it takes time with that and ACS to this and H it's all nonsense. It's all for the flow because they can all those rails exist. Right.

Gary Cardone

: But, listen, everybody, your entire audience, they're all reading digital. You're all reading digital. This is not a change. The bank that I do business with, I'm so social, you know, I do a lot of stuff on social media, and they follow me, and they're like, man, you're us up, you're killing us. And it's ridiculous. $35 wall fees, I do one a week.

Gary Cardone

: I've done 12 minutes of your staff time. They've been calling me back. I'm dropping 100 miles down the railroad. They're giving me a 17-digit PIN number. I'm like, yeah, it's every $1 million, you know. mean, well, whatever, man. I'm saying this is not security. They call me up. You have to prove them you can do your own work. Now, I'm probably one of maybe 30 people, but I just made enough noise about it. Now, I $1 There is no $35 fee. I do them in two minutes, man. It's slick as shit.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Right, and I'm supposed to confirm that,

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Yep.

Gary Cardone

: It's just a million digital assets. All you're doing in this bill, this digital bill, anybody that's got political connections, gains people and say that the banks are really, really denying the digital bill, okay? They were terrified of standing the real consumer 200 bank's points for doing nothing, okay? And you should be ashamed of yourself, Jamie.

Gary Cardone

: diamond. You should be ashamed of yourself. You certainly can do something better than make 200 basis points and then take it from my grandmother. It's like you don't love your country if you're doing that. We need people proud and spending money. We don't need them having vampires just attach it. This is what we can use this for. Like these companies, they know Netflix is going to charge grandma on a Wednesday.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Yeah, it's ridiculous.

Gary Cardone

: And she does not have enough money, but they know for a fee she has enough money, and they bang her for $23.80.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Yeah. Yeah.

Gary Cardone

: I think we're making progress. Did you see the bill already? Netflix did a subscription change. They came out and said, we're finding 400 million fucking dollars. You can't do that. And every European country behind them going, really? This is really cool. Because the consumer's just being harmed with subscription fees if they didn't really read the details to it. Right?

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: No, I didn't.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: I didn't see that. Wow.

Gary Cardone

: Yeah, they're saying it's not lawful, have no legitimate reason to raise prices. You're a software company. It's the new group response.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Wow. let's before we wrap it up, if you're willing to make a comment about where Bitcoin is now and why and why it doesn't matter or does matter. know, a lot of people are saying it went up to the high. What made it go down to the low? Was it the people who really are moving the market like we talked about earlier? Is it not that? What is it? What is it that caused it to be?

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: 131 or whatever it was now to 60 something.

Gary Cardone

: Well, it went to $1.26 off the prior high of $69, which was three and a half years ago. It's back at $71,000 a day. It's up $4,000 just on this crude oil news or the Iran news. Bitcoin has the most successful ETF in the history of ETFs. If that means anything to you, it means something to me that...

Gary Cardone

: I mean there's thousands and thousands of ETFs and all of sudden Bitcoin just pops up two years ago and becomes not by a little bit, but like by 10x the greatest ETF, the most interested, the most liquid. Mr. Morgan Stanley just launched theirs yesterday or today at the cheapest rates by the way, .17 basis points of fees than any other ETF in history. See what I'm saying?

Gary Cardone

: All the data is coming, hey fees are dropping, why? Volumes explode in a highly transparent market. Just look at the commodity market. They explode. And the legacy guys hate it because they're not, they're like, oh can we make it up in volume? Because at some point they have to report to their analysts, hey our 24 % margins go into 12 next month, next quarter. And then they need a year to make up in the volume. So, a little book calling, this is the way I like to explain it.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Right.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Yeah.

Gary Cardone

: I think Arthur one, I'm usually four or five, six years early to transition like this. And this is all I have ever done. didn't mean to do it, but I've always ended up in disruptive or looking at gap. All right. I look for gaps and I saw the credit card thing. I don't know. I think credit card industry, but this is funny. It's interesting. Let's go figure it out.

Gary Cardone

: So one, I go, I'm always in the early, you know. I saw the people before me come into this, Dan Topiro, Dan Hill, bunch of guys before me. Their personalities are a little different than mine. They were even earlier. They were willing to take much more risk than me. Now maybe I had more money than they had when they took all this risk, because buying something at $30 or 300, a thousand times, it was not the same as buying

Gary Cardone

: 71,000 is that thousand times. This is the market we have right now. I'm gonna give you a different spin where I think prices are doing what they're doing. We have 5 million coins currently. We're held at, I think, let's just call it below $1,000. And they're in a $71,000 market. This is the Royals. Royals, OG coins. You can pretty much see this on the blockchain if you look deep enough in it. I think these people are part of the problem.

Gary Cardone

: When I know a ton of people in crypto and they hear me say this all the time, I don't know if you guys anywhere, but look, when you bought something at 300, your viewpoint and your incentives are very different than someone buying something at 71,000. Here's one, for instance. If you wanted to, you lost four fucking million coins. At 71,000, you haven't lost a coin. What do you want me? Oh wow, maybe it's respecting the coin more, so people take different

Gary Cardone

: handles with it. Also, maybe the buyer is more mature today, which I most certainly think that's true. I think the buyer that you've seen in last four years are people that have staying power that crypto has never seen before. This is real money with real mature decisions. We don't panic. We don't like, oh, I'm a Chase 126. I have 57, 62, 65, $66,000 bids. Come hit me.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Yeah.

Gary Cardone

: I think the crypto people, especially anyone that's in this, like one thing I did not understand, I think the crypto people overpitched it, was Bitcoin's gonna run away from you. My perspective is, if you're patient in this one, Bitcoin will come to you. It will really come to you. You do not need to panic. You don't need to freak out. What I do is I look at this as, I have Bitcoin at 71,000. I can go building another business. That'll cost me.

Gary Cardone

: million dollars at least. So, 10 Bitcoin, probably 100 Bitcoin, 10 Bitcoin, I get to hire HR, I get to sign a bunch of NDAs, I get to hire some people, I've got to come up with a good idea, I've got to get an office space, I can go do a franchise at Popeyes, or let's go run a Popeyes franchise, two and a half million dollars, I now have a partner in

Gary Cardone

: I have to do K1s, have employees, I have to buy insurance, I have to buy grease, I know I'm going to get sued, I'm probably selling poison, and I'm going to hate my life.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Yeah, that's what I was going to say. What kind of lifestyle is that? No, thank you.

Gary Cardone

: I get to work $20 a day and I make less than my employees or I could buy Bitcoin $71,000 phone shots into a, I think, the whole grow of monopolies that has more DOJ exposure. More DOJ exposure whatsoever. And I get to pick this business up and take it anywhere in the world I want. And it gives me an option, both a put and a call,

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Right.

Gary Cardone

: put on the past legacy wall, right, and a call on the future of digitalization. And I pay no option premiums and it never, ever expires. 24-7. Verne is an interesting product. I've never seen that product before. Any of you who can't do that, right, imagine saving a billion dollars for the oil.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: future.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Yeah. No, I don't know anything you can do. Yeah.

Gary Cardone

: You could, you would you would need all the money in four wars just from storing it.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Yeah, the storage is a problem across the board because it's friction that people don't think about. It's just a perfunctory requirement, right?

Gary Cardone

: The way I tell the over community is, look, look at Bitcoin with 71,000. It's too difficult to get. This was really missold. The friction points. It took even Ashko 52 years to get credit cards in everyone's pocket. We're not even the people who do Bitcoin. Not that we're making it so difficult. It just needs to show up. Boom, Bitcoin.

Gary Cardone

: I don't, you know, it's just a lot of friction points and that's just about somebody coming up with a better solution. The ETFs most certainly are a gateway into Bitcoin. For very big families and pensions, they're not going to self-custody. And I think this is the message your people should bring to the crypto people. Families worth a billion dollars are not going to self-custody for all billion dollars. They might do it for a price, but they're not going to.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: No way.

Gary Cardone

: It's too much risk.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Yeah, the ETF is a good solution. I can't believe it's that low. That's good to know.

Gary Cardone

: What would mean that low? Oh, in the fees? Well, I listen, we've been going to, I just picked up, because I don't know where the market's going, I just bought STRC, which pays an 11.5 % dividend, monthly, 17 % tax rate. That's just $11 from every mutual fund. STRC.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Friction, yeah, friction.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: What, what, what, STI what? I'm gonna write it down.

Gary Cardone

: Yeah, it's MicroStrategy's dividend product. It's a preferred A, so it's $4 million to MSTR, paid 11.5%. You've seen him $5 million. I bought $5 worth of stuff two days ago because I've got cash. I don't know what to do with it. It's low and sitting in an F2F sim, paying me monthly at 11.5%. And I can liquidate any time I want. No fees, no entries, no exits.

Gary Cardone

: And it's a money market account. I mean, I live in my bank and dude, I don't sit near your 10.5 % thing. Move it to FDHF. I told my brother this and he was like, wow, that's an awesome product for a cash suite for business.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: And so

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Yeah. So why is the tax rate one that you know?

Gary Cardone

: The way we pitch this deal under the laws of how it's labeled, it's different than the things, if I make a million dollars in income from a dividend, I'm playing that ordinary income, from a share of that dividend, well, he called it something different, it just has a different tax calculation. I think it's because he's giving me monthly dividends and he's saying, this is your principal back.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: yeah, I got it.

Gary Cardone

: He's calling with something slightly different. Now who knows? Now this is what's to me very interesting. I went to my bank and I have some loans with them and I said, look, you got me in five million dollars where the treasury's at three. I'd you to go talk to your risk management team about moving all of that over to STRC. And they said, well, how long's it been around? Nine months. They'll never do it. It's similar to an STRD. I know you'll do it. So they looked at it.

Gary Cardone

: 24 hours later, they're like, hey, we'll approve you to take 60 % of the funds out of the bonds and move them to STRC. That tripled my yield. And I don't think that bank isn't happy. The the four bank guys are going, hey, this is a good idea, dude. We should get all our guys into this shit. I mean, really, man, they should be pushing this product. So.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Right.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Yeah.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Yeah, exactly. Yeah.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Yeah, Gary, you gotta tell me it's STRC.

Gary Cardone

: Yeah, STLT is the preferred dividend product of MSTR, MicroStrategy, or what's known as Strategy today. It's a micro-storage company.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Yeah, sailor.

Gary Cardone

: Now, the reason I brought that up is to tell you this, he would spend 11.5 % to borrow money to buy Bitcoin.

Gary Cardone

: Now I don't, I'm not going to spell at 12, but I think it's pretty fascinating. I think he's offering too much. did not need to offer that much, but wow, what a great product. It competes with real estate. It competes with money market. It competes with every pension.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Yeah.

Gary Cardone

: 11.5 % in perpetuity and it's covered up with collateral. I think it's most covered up collateral in your evidence and your bearing product like that.

Gary Cardone

: So the world, and it's huge, I mean, it's a massive, I mean, you can imagine why people like it right now.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Yeah, and is it backed partly by MicroStrategy's balance sheet?

Gary Cardone

: It's backed by the Bitcoin, separate and apart from. And it's senior too.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Yeah.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Yeah.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Why? Let's think about that. I'd like to talk about this forever, but I gotta run. Why is why is why is he doing that? What's it up for micro strategy?

Gary Cardone

: Yeah, no chance.

Gary Cardone

: This may be longer than you heard, but I think if you look at Stoller's business model, was really more and more favor of Bitcoin too. He realized no one could buy Bitcoin. Not wrapped up the way it was wrapped up and sold. So he created this public, and he was able to sue one of the funds that had probably not done it correctly, Growth Cale.

Gary Cardone

: They'd probably not done the Bitcoin ETF correctly. He realized all the ETFs were going come out. I think he rushed to the market and said, I'm going to create a product where people can buy an equity they're used to and comfortable with, and I'm going to support it with the Bitcoin underneath it. So Gary, like the Norwegian Pension Fund, when they dumped the withdrawals, they said, we're not doing business with withdrawals anymore. They made half a billion dollars into not Bitcoin, but in FTR.

Gary Cardone

: Right? Because it is an easy product. The pension's already qualified to buy equities, and they're about half a billion dollars' worth. And people are buying the SQFT product. I think, to answer your question, I think he saw the bond rules. He saw the money market rules. And he said, I am going to make this so attractive, I'm going to suck as much cash out of the money market accounts as possible. This is what's thinking with the banks.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Yeah.

Gary Cardone

: And they're resisting the digital bill because they're like, hey, we just had this sale guy just put, like, sale is taking business from my guys. For sure. Okay? Like, I'm hearing from Thringo 11. Thringo 11, that is a massive change. And I have no tie-ups. You probably don't have a product like that. You probably almost all your products still do. Just give me 30 days notice.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Exactly. Yeah.

Gary Cardone

: Right? And I'm getting paid monthly. I don't have to wait for a whole year. So, and it's covered up. I don't know whether any of my bonds are covered up with collateral. I have no clue. I'm assuming they're not covered up at all.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Super interesting.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Yeah.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: You're right. Exactly. No, there's the bonds are there, whatever the underlying thing, they're the company they're invested in. Who knows? I mean, the credit quality on the bonds is suspect anyway, because of what we went through with 2008. So that's that nonsense is still happening. All right, Gary, you know what? If it's okay with you, I super appreciate you doing this. And I don't I don't I don't want to lean on you again, but can we

Gary Cardone

: Yeah.

Gary Cardone

: You're awesome man, I appreciate it.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Do another one and just talk about this stuff.

Gary Cardone

: Yeah, love to. And if you want some more information, I I've looked up with some really cool people. I know a group that are only studying MSGR and SGRC products. So anytime you want some, you know, input, sometimes we do, we'll do a space in this and we just drill down into the entire product suite. And it's really, I mean, from the family, it's an awesome place for them to come to, not to have to listen to some bank guy who doesn't.

Gary Cardone

: really know what he's talking about. just read the perspective. And he doesn't really care. Well, you don't care when you don't really know. You don't have to answer question to come across stuff. Happy to do it, And you have to answer your questions, so that helps.

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: doesn't care right yeah yeah yeah yeah

Arthur Andrew Bavelas

: Yeah, I appreciate that. Yeah, I really appreciate you being here and let's let's do that follow up. All right. Thanks, Jay. Thanks, everybody for being here.

Gary Cardone

: Yeah, for sure. Thanks, guys.

Gary Cardone

: Yeah, thank you.